Mounting from a block

Mary Poppins

Mary Poppins

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Oct 10, 2004
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I mainly ride 2 horses. I have my share horse (Bailey) who I ride twice a week, and then another horse (Spencer) who I normally ride at my riding school once a week. I have the same problem with both of them in that they will often move their bum away from the mounting block just before I am about to get on. My old mare used to do this as well, but she would move forward rather than away from me (and yes I did once end up behind the saddle!).

So, as there seems to be a common trend in all the horses I ride, I must be doing something wrong when I mount. Can someone give me an idiots step by step guide on how to mount from a block correctly. And, what do I do if the horse does decide to move? At the moment I just take him round again and hope for the best. It has taken me 10 minutes to get on Bailey before and it's just embarrassing! We have sorted out all the barging/leading/respect issues and he is now very easy to lead, but now he has decided to try this. Any advice is appreciated.
 
The horse should wait for you to get yourself sorted, get on, and do anything you want.

You are doing the right thing by putting them back there, so don't feel pressured or embarrassed.

I believe Flipo's Mum has used clicker training successfully to overcome her big boy's reluctance to stand and wait. I have too, so let us know if you'd like to know about it.
 
Jane&Ziggy said:
I believe Flipo's Mum has used clicker training successfully to overcome her big boy's reluctance to stand and wait. I have too, so let us know if you'd like to know about it.
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I have a book on clicker training for horses, so maybe I will dig it out and re-read. I remember that people on my old yard laughed at the very concept of clicker training and I got to the point where my share horse at the time would touch a series of buckets with his nose, but I didn't really understand how to transfer this into the next stage. Once I took away the actual treat, my horse didn't seem to think that the click was a reward in itself and therefore took no notice of it.
 
You need to stick with the treats for quite a while. And you need to have got the horse accustomed to doing things for treats. So with Ziggy we moved from targeting to doing things he already knew the commands for like "Stand", "Back up" and "Foot."

I very often have to jump on him from a log, bank or fence. So I have trained him using the clicker to follow my hand, this gets him in position. Then I say "Stand" and he stands like a rock until I have clambered aboard. Then he used to get a click and a treat. Now he gets a "Good boy" so I don't have to carry the clicker, and either a treat or a pat (we have reached the "variable reward schedule").

I can see it would be really difficult to do this though when surrounded by scathing people. So you could use the old fashioned method of just patiently putting the horse back in position every single time it walks off. You have to be more patient than the horse!
 
Bailey is like a horse possessed if you give him any treats though. He starts to mug and nip you and I fear that he will start biting if I reguarly reward him with food.
 
Yep we had this problem. After back, tack and teeth were checked, I worked out that the amount of faffing about was directly correlated to how nervous I was about getting on. He would react to my lack of confidence and choose to muck about more.
Ok, I couldn't remove the nerves completely, but he needed to understand that despite the stench of fear I was giving off, I was still in charge and he had to listen. I have a moveable mounting block and a friend advised that I should just keep moving it to him everytime he sidestepped or shifted back until he realised there was no point in moving as I would get on eventually. Trouble is Flip was a stubborn wee b&gger and would quite happily shift round and round for an hour (that was our longest attempt). I then, from advice on here, changed tack and moved him to the block. Moving his feet is key, and backing up is my most powerful weapon. Circling doesn't work for us as Flip could quite happily plod around all day, but he absolutely HATEs being backed up.
I'm very disciplined now. If he so much as moves an inch, shuffles sideways, backwards or forewards, I get off the block and make him back up about two metres.

I have done clicker training to the block in the field on days where I haven't ridden, just five minutes getting him to stand still, click, treat, then progressed to putting foot on block, click, treat, and then all the way to being able to lean over him without any movement.
I also groomed from the block incase he had issues with me being so high up. Oh and another thing that worked wonders was to line him up to the block from the offside and praise with clicker. Something to do with the lack of association with mounting on the offside helped to reset this learned bad behaviour.

Sorry for the length of this, in essence the main thing I'd suggest is try backing up any time they side step/move rather than circling. Yield the hindquarters back to the block as well if the swing their bootie out. Oh and if you can, mount with something blocking his offside.
Ramble over! (Can you tell its something I'm passionate about!!)
 
I agree with Flipo's mum. Grace would always wait till I was on mounting block and then swing out, or take one step backwards or forwards argh! My RI thought that she was anticipating moving away once I had mounted. The solution was to put her in place and then take my time. I would have a little wander around her, get on block and off again. If she moved I would put her back again with no fuss. After 3 sessions of this the problem has more or less stopped and she stands still while I mount.
 
FM - thanks for that. I will certainly try backing him up next time he does it. I have been circling him away but have been wondering if this is the right thing to do because it turns into a game. We have been working on backing up in the stable and while he does find this difficult he is starting to move with just a command (before I had to shove him with all my weight). When I try to get on, he moves his bum away from me at a 90 degree angle so he ends up looking at me. I will make sure that he moves his bum back next time and he doesn't get to move away.

I could try and get on him with him placed between the mounting block and the fence but i always thought that this was dangerous in case the genuinely spooked at something.

He is worse when I am carrying my schooling whip. I am very careful not wave it around, and he is not whip shy (although possibly slightly work shy!).
 
I'm no expert on this, not had any problems other than my share occasionally taking a step to far at the block (probably my fault) so he gets backed up into the correct position. I have also been taught to get a tight grip of reins and a handful of mane when mounting so you have control. Maybe a sharp tug when he starts to fidget might let him know that it is not acceptable.

I would agree backing him up would be a better option rather than circling him away, if you think about it, he is moving, then getting directed away from the block, I would rather try and get him back to where he is meant to be with as little movement as possible.

I would suggest working on moving his hindquarters on the ground, get it so that he works off voice command, then when he swings his back end away from the block you should be able to get him back with the voice command, or if you can reach over with the schooling whip giving him a small tap to get him back over. I think repitition is key too, and praise when he does well.
 
Agree that it feels scary mounting right next to the fence, but I found I didn't have to have him right up against something, just about a metre away from it was enough to act as a barrier. And it didn't necessarily have to be a fence. We have an upturned metal trough which acts as a good barrier in the field, and in the school we've got two woodwork horse things that are just high enough for him to pay attention to.
 
I think the key thing to remember is as they say to make the right thing easy and the wrong thing difficult. My chap used to lounge on the ramp of a trailer whilst I tried to entice him up with treats ...................... he really wasn't scared, just taking the pee. Now I know he hates backing up worse than the plague so once I took that tactic - get up or back up - ooh, getting on board was a far preferable option and after a yielding of the hindquarters if he swung them out, or backing up if he planted he whizzed up. It was the same with standing still for me to get on. Stand still or back up. Ooh, standing still with reins as great washing lines! It is just a question of finding the thing that your horse hates. And that might be circling or lunging for respect or anything else.
 
Some very good answers re: the clicker training but I'm afraid my advice is just a simple tip :wink: When you're ready to mount and have the reins in your left hand, make sure that the right rein is shorter than the left so the horse's head is turned to the right, that way they can't swing their bum out as well.
 
Like it joosie.

I just practiced lots with joy. Lots of verbal praise and scratches when she was right, obvious displeasure with a stern 'No!' when she wasn't and get straight off and start again.

Oh and getting her lined up on the ground to stand in the right place so she knew what to do so I could then lead her on a loose rein without looking and know she'd rake responsibility for being in the right place.

I'm a great believer in giving her the chance to do as much as possible without my interference. She was flighty and lacked confidence when I got her. The more she does freely, the calmer she is. The key thing is consistency in the boundaries. If she doesn't do it right despite knowing what's expected there is a consequence, be it being asked to move about to make more work or simply hopping off and starting again.
 
It has taken me 10 minutes to get on Bailey before and it's just embarrassing! Any advice is appreciated.
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Dont be embarassed. Most students at our RS are "mounted" by the RI at the start of the lesson - me too since my op, but in the old days I did mount myself. I did just as you describe, used Mark Rashid's method and led the horse round in a significantly large circle till she stood at the block exactly where I want. I know other people (staff coming to the end of the staff lesson) thought me wierd and it "wasted" part of my own lesson time. But it gave me satisfaction.

Once I had taught the horse before two consecutive lessons - she remembered, until I next had a break from lessons - so it was an investment worth making. I dont use treats.

But the question of what you are doing to signal to the two horses that you want them to move their bums away from you is also important and would be easier to answer, if we had a video , or description.

It might show not just what you are doing but at what point the wrong message is reaching the horse.

I have done all the following - so this is not criticism of you. For instance, it is very easy as one prepares to mount to take up the reins and ever so slightly guide the horses head towards one. Moving the front end of the horse towards one, involves the back end moving farther away.

The same shortening up of the reins might be happening as you step up onto the block. I would usually prepare to mount with the reins already back over the neck of the horse. That means holding the near side rein which - if there is any pressure there - has the same effect.

My own problem was usually the opposite - asking the mare to take one last step forward with the near side front leg, to be where I wanted her, I would inadvertenly push the front end away from me. My RI taught me to overcome this -by reaching across the horse with my schooling whip and touching her off side shoulder instead.

Ideally one should lead the horse up to the mounting black in pretty much a straight line - so when I say circle round and come back to the block, thqat doesnt mean arriving at the block on a bend - I always approach straight. If your circle ends with a bent horse at the block, that might involved the hind end being farther from you and the horse moving it yet further, to straighten itself and balance its feet to accept your weight as you mount.

I ignored other people. I would take as long as it took. I also made no distinction between the failed attempts that were due to me and those that were due to the horse - This again is Mark Rashid's philosophy. The horse is doing what it thinks is wanted, or ignoring signals as to what is wanted - but it is not the horse's fault. It is not your fault either.

And that is why he doesnt use rewards. Because he doesnt use punishments either. The horse reads the signals - and as you say, when we get the signals right - and then repeat them till they are understood as being compulsory - the horse gets the message.

I hope this may be some use. I have taught RS horses to do as I want with no rewards. Because that is how I was taught - and for me it has always worked. But it is someohow inside our brain, what we find convincing and efficient. You need to make your own choice about that.
 
Mary Poppins said:
So how did you teach them to do this?
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First session I stand on the mounting block with it up against a fence so the horse can't go around me. I ask the horse to bring its it hq's over toward me using some pressure on the leadrope and a little pressure over its back with either my hand, c stick, end of rope or schooling whip. Once the horse makes a positve step over I stop and reward. I get of the block and go away and do something completly different for 5 to 10 mins to let it sink in.

I then go back and ask again. I sometimes leave it and come back the next day if I know the horse has made a positive effort.

The next session I do similar but I stand for longer on the block once the horse has stepped over and normally scratch a nice itchy spot to teach the horse that lining up and standing in the correct place in nice.


By the third session the horse normally cannot wait to be asked to line up!
 
Skib said:
Ideally one should lead the horse up to the mounting black in pretty much a straight line - so when I say circle round and come back to the block, thqat doesnt mean arriving at the block on a bend - I always approach straight. If your circle ends with a bent horse at the block, that might involved the hind end being farther from you and the horse moving it yet further, to straighten itself and balance its feet to accept your weight as you mount.
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That is a very good point. The mounting block is on a corner and I guess that he isn't straight as I approach it - I have never thought to check this. I will try moving the block along to see if this makes a difference.

I think that I will read up about Mark Rashid. Thanks for the tips.
 
joosie said:
Some very good answers re: the clicker training but I'm afraid my advice is just a simple tip :wink: When you're ready to mount and have the reins in your left hand, make sure that the right rein is shorter than the left so the horse's head is turned to the right, that way they can't swing their bum out as well.
Click to expand...

I have been trying to do this, but he still moves away. Maybe my reins are not short enough.
 
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