Nails for shoeing and should I change farrier?

chunky monkey

chunky monkey

Well-Known Member
May 2, 2007
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I haven't been around much on here recently. Due to a few things changing, I haven't spent a great deal of time on the computer.

Anyway I wanted to ask, are there different types of nails that the farriers can use when shoeing. Are there cheap & cheerful ones and more expensive ones that are better, that they can use. I'm sure I heard someone say there are different types.

The reason I am asking is chunky keeps snapping his, he has gone three weeks and one has snapped already. The same thing happened last time he was shod. He only has front shoes, one being the bar shoe for his fractured foot. This is the one that he has pulled loose this time.

Also chunky use to go 8 weeks between shoeing with no problems of them coming loose and he didn't loose one either. Since I changed farriers he now only goes about 3 weeks and his shoes start coming loose, and the nails are snapping etc. We did have a problem with the shoe being to long and it was sticking out the back to far hence I think he caught it. Anyway we have now gone down a shoe size on both feet and they are definately not sticking out the back, so is there and reason that it could be coming loose. I know the new farrier does not take as much off when trimming and barely touchs the frog, if at all.
My only reason for saying this to you is that I am wondering if not taking as much off could be the cause. I haven't changed his diet.

Obviously I don't want to question the farrier, as they are trained in there work, but do you think that I should be looking for another farrier. If you think it might help I could take some pics at the weekend and post on hear so you can get some idea of the state of his feet.

Any ideas/suggestions would be appreciated please. Thanks.
 
If you feel the farrier isn't right for your horse then change...my farrier whilst not particularly reliable is fantastic with ruby and treats her patiently and carefully - i trust him totally.

The other more reliable farrier i don't trust and find him heavy handed - so i dont use him, although other people on the yard have the opposite opinion about which is best
 
I have basic insider knowledge because my dad was a farrier (had to stop because of cancer)
there are different nails- did you get a look at the brand?
what work are you doing and on what ground and is he turned out in a wet field.
has the shape of his foot changed? is the toe longer or shorter, more stood up on heels etc
what shoes are they? concave, driving, plates etc
do you use any studs?

and fractured foot- do you mean a crack or something else can you explain it more?
does (or has) he suffer from laminitis? this may affect the foot

why did you change farriers in the first place and could you get the old one to come back?
 
I don't know if there are different quality nails but I know they come in different sizes - my farrier uses the finest he can to nail Jim's shoes on to minimise damage to the wall but it does increase the chance of nails breaking.

I can't really pass comment on the rest, I haven't seen chunky's feet & anyway I'm not an expert - I just picked things up because I own a horse with poor feet, have an exceptionally good & informative farrier & read up on things that interest me.
 
chunky monkey said:
Obviously I don't want to question the farrier, as they are trained in there work, but do you think that I should be looking for another farrier.
Click to expand...

I'm always chatting to my farrier and asking him questions.

I would advise speaking to your farrier about the problems and asking him if he feels there is something else that can be tried.

I really can't see the problem in taking an interest in your horse's wellbeing and striking up conversation.

If I had a farrier or vet or any horsecare professional that I feel wasn't approachable then I would be looking for somebody else.

How would your farrier feel if you just swapped though because you didn't want to question him :eek:
 
there is different lengths and sizes that vary between makes
thin nails suit t/b feet because they are usually brittle and thin
where about are the nails on the feet- near the top or bottom or middle
are they in a straight line
and is the shoe fitted to the foot not the other way round
is it hot or cold shoeing?
 
Joyscarer. I know exactly what you mean about talking to the farrier and yes I do ask questions, and I did mention to him about the nails snapping and the coming loose after 3 weeks, and I got a vague answer like it happens occasionally. This is the second time now they have snapped. So I am a bit fed up.

This new farrier, which I have been using now since about sept I think, I have to say isn't as approachable as the old one.

xloopylozzax. I did post ages back about my farrier change in a rant I had, and basically I think someone at the yard upset him by booking and then cancelling for there horse, mine was booked in at the same time. The farrier tried to cancel with me because of it and because I had to arrange especially an afternoon of work I wouldn't cancel. So the farrier came out to me. Then about three days later the person that had cancelled for there horse had to try to ring and get the farrier out asap as the horse lost its shoe. So I think the farrier was really cross with them and as a result he wouldn't answer there call to his mobile and didn't respond to there messages they left. So the other person had to get a different farrier as a result. When I try 8 weeks later to ring the farrier to get him out to do chunky he wouldn't answer my calls either or the couple of messages I left. So I in the end I had to get a new farrier and because of what happened I didn't want to use the same farrier as the other person at the yard, so I opted for a completely seperate one, so as to avoid any issues.
 
I have a nail in my hand as it happens, the new farrier dropped it in the yard when he first came out to me and I have kept it on my side in my room since. Don't ask me why.

Anyway, just looked at it and all it has on it is an m

So perhaps that stands for medium, don't know. Its 5.7cm's long.

The farrier hot shoes.

He is a cob. He has never had laminitis as far as I know. I have had him 15months now and I use the same vet as the previous owner did so I know the veterinary history. This week with all the rain the field is very soggy, but he is not ankle deep in mud. I have been moving him where possible to a fresh peice of pasture on a regular basis so as not to churn up the field. I am sensible about field management.
The fractured foot was a fractured pedal bone, and oh god it will be a year tomorrow since he did it. So I am hoping for no bad omans tomorrow.
The vet said he should wear the bar shoe for a year. Last time the farrier came out to me we discussed perhaps just leaving the bar shoe on until such time as it wore out. (That is one issue that I do have as I know most people have a set of new shoes every other visit.) In between most people normally have a trim & refit and then the next time the farrier comes out they have a brand new set. Which is what my previous farrier use to do. As it happens, because we went down a size on the bar shoe the previous visit he just had a trim and refit this time in any case. So should I be getting a new set put on every other visit?

xloopylozzax: 'where about are the nails on the feet- near the top or bottom or middle
are they in a straight line
and is the shoe fitted to the foot not the other way round '
Can you elaborate more on these for me. I couldn't tell you off the top of my head, so if you elaborate a bit for me, so I understand I will check. Although i won't be able to check till the weekend when its daylight. During the week I don't get up to see him till after dark.

Don't use any studs.
Has been ridden about 5 times a week for the last 3 months as I have not been working. As of last week I will now only be able to ride at the weekend until the clocks change, due to going back to work. Hack out for between 3/4 of an hour to 2 hours. Each time. Road work/grass land/stoney ground. (But bear in mind he use to go 8 weeks between visits and I still ride the same amount and places, so I can't think this is an issue, unless of course it is because the nails are thinner ones that are being used now. That I don't know.)

I don't know what type of shoes they are. Dump answer I know, but they just look like shoes to me. Don't know what the difference is? Perhaps thats a question I should ask my farrier.

I don't think the new farrier fits the shoes as well as the previous one. Besides not trimming as much off. My previous farrier use to heat the shoes and then knock them around more and kept going back to the horse and trying it for size then heat and knock it around more etc. This one just seems to heat and applie. So is this what you mean when you refer to:' is the shoe fitted to the foot not the other way round'?
 
If the nails are snapping off it is a sign the wrong size is being used.

the nails have to fit the nailhole in the shoe and the fullering. If they are snapping, it generally means they are not the right size for the shoe.
 
just because the farrier doesnt go backwards and forwards from the foot to the anvil doesnt mean it isnt correctly fitted- my dad just "learnt" (dont ask me how) how the foot was and the shape and made the shoe the right size from memory- if it was a horse he had shod for a long time and the feet were no different he didnt have to make an effort to look he just knew. he can also tell which horse on the yard made which hoofprints- seriously clever considering they all wear the same brand and size and studs.

as for is the shoe fitted to the foot not the other way round, does he have to rasp alot after clenching (turning nail ends down) if yes then a bigger shoe may be needed. but i obviously cant say exactly cos i aren't trained and i havent seen the foot ;)

are the shoes general riding shoes like these (concave) http://www.pledger.co.uk/Original_concave.asp

or flat like driving shoes (no cancave line in the middle)
are the bar shoes plain bars or heart bars?
http://www.pledger.co.uk/shoe_Surgical.asp
(middle of first option- they may have a straight edge along top instead of a dip)

My dad tends to use heart bars because they support the pedal bone more
http://www.spequine.com/images/fetlck_400.gif
(the pedal bone is also known as the coffin bone.)

are the nails like this?
http://www.mustadhoofcare.com/eng/homepage.html
(click on products, nails and reg on first options to see picture)
they are a good brand so no trouble there.
they sound like a six or seven which is the right size for an average cob.

where the nail ends are clenched are they in a straight line (cant find picture sorry) or are they all diferent lengths.
in relation to the foot are they in the middle of the foot (length wise) or closer to the bottom or top.
Also are the clenches close to the foot or do they stick out- run your fingers over them evenly if you chop your hand off and run up and down over them rather then them been flush to the hoof (thats why they rasp underneath the nail so it has somewhere to lay) then they are stuck out and need to be clenched tighter
I know/knew horses that had new sets of shoes only every 3/4 visits because they weren't doing heavy work or roadwork- theres no point wasting your money on new shoes when you dont need them!
when you hack out is it trotting or mainly walking on the roads.

Has his hoof quality changed- have you changed hay/haylege supplies or to a cheaper feed mix.
 
The M on the nail stands for Mustad! It also acts as a quick reference guide for the farrier as to which way around the nail goes without having to constantly observe the point in minute detail!

Different makes of nail have a different symbol on them.


It is something you learn, you get the shape of the foot you want to shoe in your head, and you got the the anvil and can be failry close and sometimes spot on with the first fitting.
 
there is another (cheaper) brand that has an M in a different style though so you can just tell the difference.
cant remember name off hand though sorry.
 
yes mondial- my dad found that they bend the wrong way occasionally (into the foot instead of out towards the hoof wall) so had to remember to turn the end point out a bit more.
nice to clench though- i used to help him finish off at home (not on other peoples before i get "argh!" comments) and they tightened really well
were they more like this?
http://www.mondialhorsenails.com/SITO_IN_INGLESE/PACKING/packaging.html
 
Thanks guys, will read your posts when I have a touch more time. I will try to take some before and after pics at the weekend. The farrier is due out this Saturday.
 
farriers

If theres one thing I've learnt over the years is that farriers will not readily discuss the technical side of their trade. It seems to me that some of you are suffering the plague of poor farriers that seem to exist out there.
Nail breakage is a problem you should definitely not have, and a good farrier will be only too willing to return and rectify such a problem free of charge if it happens within days of shoeing.
Sad to say that the Farriers Registration Act is failing to keep up standards, and it seems to be promoting the trade as one for young lads to make money in without any real love of the job.
Can I suggest that like many trades you are better off going to a person of fourty years old !.
 
andrew.snowdon1 said:
If theres one thing I've learnt over the years is that farriers will not readily discuss the technical side of their trade. It seems to me that some of you are suffering the plague of poor farriers that seem to exist out there.
Nail breakage is a problem you should definitely not have, and a good farrier will be only too willing to return and rectify such a problem free of charge if it happens within days of shoeing.
Sad to say that the Farriers Registration Act is failing to keep up standards, and it seems to be promoting the trade as one for young lads to make money in without any real love of the job.
Can I suggest that like many trades you are better off going to a person of fourty years old !.
Click to expand...

I've certainly not found farriers unwilling to discuss technical matters, indeed my current one is very happy to if he thinks someone is interested.

Some of the most consciencious (sp?) farriers I've had have been younger than forty, though sometimes I did get fed up with listening to the love life sagas!
 
my dad (alot older than forty i must admit) would quite happily explain what he was doing and why (remedial and normal shoeing/ trimming)
and i personally would rather listen to love life sagas than old time life storys!
and i like a bit of eyecandy!
nothing better than a muscular tanned man... lol
 
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