Some more advice please

michelle18

michelle18

New Member
Jun 1, 2015
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Sorry to be a pest again.

Just wanted some opinions, I had previously posted a thread about being told the horse has gastric ulcers and the owner wanted a second opinion - so the second opinion said he doesn't so we had to give up that fight we were told that we weren't riding enough (we ride about 4-6 times a week for at least 30 minutes) so we've to ride him everyday for a good hour. We still can't get him out of bucking in canter he's getting us off constantly everytime we try I've just got a promotion so didn't want to risk injury and have to call in sick so the last 2 weeks we have just been doing walk and trot and the occasional hack. We decided to have a go and see what he would be like cantering on a lunge. He walked round fine, trotted fine then we got to the canter and his back legs just went under him and he fell down, he got straight back up and one of the girls at the yard said just to keep going he's just unfit. So got him cantering again and he fell face down and got back up and just kept tripping. We still have our concerns with him.

So what do you guys think?
Should I be riding everyday for at least an hour? He is 15 yo tb.

And is falling this much in canter fitness related?

I will post a link to my previous post incase you want to have a read at that.

Any advice would be great
 
Does he trip when you ride him normally, or was it just on the lunge.

Sounds like pain and that could mean any number of issues.

I would not be riding and I would get vet if he was mine. If it was a loan and owners were not cooperating I would probably give the horse back to them. (Easy to say I know)
 
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When I'm riding he'll just buck occasionally I get a few strides but more bucks than strides. I'm really considering giving him back, but it breaks my heart I love the wee guy to bits. I'm new to it all so I just don't think anyone at the yard takes it seriously when I worry. I had the vet out due to some issues I mentioned in my previous post she said she thinks it's ulcers and my farrier said his back legs felt off but the owner got another vet out and they both rubbished it.
 
Was he racked up to lunge? Do you have a secure school to free school?

One point to check is a tack issue - whether he does this without tack on

And the other would be if he is unbalanced on the lunge this would exacerbate things.

Tripping is not a sign of being unfit in my eyes unless you are running him ragged into exhaustion.

Does he ever run about in the field?
 
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Did the vet scope him? I'm confused, if the first vet diagnosed ulcers and the second one says not someone's equipment needs checking, or their eyesight, or had he been treated between your first vet diagnosing and the second vet?
Either way something doesn't sit right here, it's great that you want to get to the bottom of things and I do understand that you love him, but I can't help feeling that his owner isn't being honest with you for some reason.
 
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Has he been scoped? Because this is the only way to diagnose ulcers properly, though a trial of GastroGard or Peptizole is sometimes used because if the horse improves significantly then it's almost certainly ulcers. However the trial is an expensive way to find out & most insurance companies would want a scope if you're looking to claim for GastroGard or Peptizole to treat. You can get a test done on a poo sample, but it's not as reliable.

To me the back end giving way on the lunge suggests that there's more going on than ulcers. They may be part of the issue but they wouldn't normally cause that.
 
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Do not ride the poor horse there is clearly issues here and he is hurting. I know you care but this is going to get expensive and he us not yours at the end of the day.

I own a tb that had ulcers. A full course of treatment then a change in diet and way of keeping.

I know every hair ear movement and swish of his tail. I know pain discomfort from Cheeky to rude. A horse falling and repeat bucking is for one dangerous to ride and two in pain and trying the only way he can to get off.

The two vet thing confuses me. Did they both scope? The whole things sounds wrong to me
 
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He was tacked up, we booked a saddle fitter but the owner asked us to cancel as the vet she had up checked the fit and said it was fine.

We definitely don't over exert him in the eyes of the yard owner and the horses owner we don't ride enough.

I have seen him in a few occasions excitedly galloping towards us when we go into the field to bring him in but he's never been one for running around the field just has a wander around grazing. He is slightly unbalanced but we can't seem to get a decent canter either riding or on lunge to help balance him up. I personally think he looks very stiff in the back end but according to the yo and owner he's fine.

We only have a small indoor school.


popularfurball said:
Was he racked up to lunge? Do you have a secure school to free school?

One point to check is a tack issue - whether he does this without tack on

And the other would be if he is unbalanced on the lunge this would exacerbate things.

Tripping is not a sign of being unfit in my eyes unless you are running him ragged into exhaustion.

Does he ever run about in the field?
Click to expand...
 
No the vet we got up said ulcers and strongly recommended a scope which I was going to pay for.

The owner then got her vet to check and he said he was fine.

There was no scope done.

Sorry for the confusion.

My farrier also said he thought he had issues with the back legs but when I told the owner she said I should get a new farrier as he doesn't know what he's doing. But he is a highly recommended farrier.
 
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So basically she had told you all your medically professional arecruitment crap.

I would never let my vet look at my saddle fit. That'd like asking my dentist to check my liver. Rubbish.

You areally not over riding 5-6 days is plenty for a leisure horse.
 
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I think that the owner is choosing to see what she wants to see - and that sounds like whatever is the cheapest option for her!

There are obviously issues that need to be sorted. Horses do not normally buck in canter, and horses should not fall down on the lunge. A vet cannot check the saddle fit and the only way to determine if the horse has ulcers is to scope. If the farrier said there were issues with the back legs, why wouldn't you investigate further? Why wouldn't the owner want you to sort out any of this?

If I were you, I would have a honest talk to the owner and tell her that you want to horse properly checked and treated, or you will be forced to give him back. If your gut instinct tells you that the horse has a problem, you are probably right.
 
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Mary Poppins said:
I think that the owner is choosing to see what she wants to see - and that sounds like whatever is the cheapest option for her!

There are obviously issues that need to be sorted. Horses do not normally buck in canter, and horses should not fall down on the lunge. A vet cannot check the saddle fit and the only way to determine if the horse has ulcers is to scope. If the farrier said there were issues with the back legs, why wouldn't you investigate further? Why wouldn't the owner want you to sort out any of this?

If I were you, I would have a honest talk to the owner and tell her that you want to horse properly checked and treated, or you will be forced to give him back. If your gut instinct tells you that the horse has a problem, you are probably right.
Click to expand...

This.

I know & can understand that you're worried about the horse & want to do what's best for him, but if I'm honest I can't help thinking that the best thing for you would be to walk away because his owner is abusing not only him but you. I'm sorry.
 
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Falling on the lunge is definitely not the norm for an unfit horse, they might not want to work, drag their heels a little, perhaps stumble a little at the end of a long hard session but falling over isnt right.

I'm afraid I tend to agree with the others, if she won't treat his issues you don't really have any other choice than to give him back :(
 
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Were you there when his owner had the second vet out to him @michelle18 ? I am going to guess not, I'm really sorry but I think his owner is taking you for a fool, it's so sad that you want the best for him and she is blocking every move you make to help, I don't understand that at all, if he is genuinely doing all that you say he needs a thorough check and treatment for any issues found, not just left to be ridden through it, whatever 'it' may be.
Not only is this downright cruel to the horse it sounds potentially dangerous for you and your sister.
 
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We were there when the vet was up but he never really spoke to us just the owner she said he wasn't doing all the things when she was there and that we were overreacting because this is our first horse. I think your right - I think unfortunately it has come to let hammond go back to his owner as much as we want to keep him.
 
We have decided unfortunately to give him back. Surprise the owner now has him up for sale after refusing to sell him to us.... thanks guys for all your advice it has helped so much. I'm just so devastated I've had to give him back :(:(:(
 
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