If Hunt Horses are looked after properly then they should have no probs at all.Often i have found that when they come to retire they made fantastic 1st horses,go into showing,we have had one who is now a RDA horse and worth his weight in gold!
If Hunt Horses are looked after properly then they should have no probs at all.Often i have found that when they come to retire they made fantastic 1st horses,go into showing,we have had one who is now a RDA horse and worth his weight in gold!
I don't have enough of my own knowledge to form an opinion so I have been a firm fence sitter.
After reading this whole thread over the past few days I'm still on the fence! Some good points made on both sides but I haven't been firmly shifted in either direction
(I am quite heavy 
)
After reading this whole thread over the past few days I'm still on the fence! Some good points made on both sides but I haven't been firmly shifted in either direction
(I am quite heavy )
They are on the estates land who run the hunt!!!
Im sure i will cause a big fuss if the horses get stressed!!! im glad i wasnt on there last year, Thankyou Yann, if one single pellet comes anywhere near the yard i will ring the police if ym doesnt speak to them! As the yard is private and not part of the estate, and we are having to bring in our horses because of them in nearby fields and woodlands.
I dont think you will be answered on this one, as i havnt had an answer for my question on ''what fox hunters think to elephants being hunted and killed in Africa for ruining crops'' ???
sorry for 3 in a row, but my god has anyone else read those links from india's post, its horrific, how can anyone want to be part of hunting an animal???
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jaydevon
Guest
ok ok i will amswer you! what do i think? not alot, it doesnt cross my mind often, well unless watching a program to be honest. HOWEVER most animals belong to nobody, for many years animals have been a part of other countries food sources/income in reality what rights does anybody have? ok so theres extinsion,but with goverments etc monitoring animals of all sorts theres less chance of extinsion.
whilst were all focusing on the bad points of hunting, why dont we focus on the good aspects such as...
the jobs/business created,
the services the hunt offer
what else does hunting do? for example how many people know that point 2 pointers etc need to of hunted so many times before they can race (12 i think) why is this?
That is disputed. What would happen to fox numbers if they were not hunted? All the available evidence suggests that it wouldn't make much difference - for example, there wasn't a detectable increase in fox numbers as a result of hunting being suspended in the 2001 outbreak of foot-and-mouth disease. The reason is that other factors determining fox population far outweigh mortality due to hunting, and the fact that foxes are territorial naturally limits their population density.
My god what a complete waste of web space this is turning out to be!!!
Its the same arguments couched in different terms and I cant find a new original statement in the last 20 pages!!!
Come on people why not just agree to disgree. Some people dont like hunting and some people do!!! Your NOT going to change each others minds with your arguments and for us people who are neither for or against are just watching this with exasperated mirth.
Nikki xxxx
Its the same arguments couched in different terms and I cant find a new original statement in the last 20 pages!!!
Come on people why not just agree to disgree. Some people dont like hunting and some people do!!! Your NOT going to change each others minds with your arguments and for us people who are neither for or against are just watching this with exasperated mirth.
Nikki xxxx
Y
Yann
Guest
What's your problem? If you don't want to participate in the discussion, then just ignore it
It's arguable that your post is also a waste of cyberspace since it doesn't contribute anything to the discussion
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jaydevon
Guest
had a look, maybe im just cold hearted, but to be honest if the country wants to ban hunting with hounds then surely it needs to ban fishing, battery chicken farms etc, whats the point of one with out the other? every day every animal suffers at the hands of humans, being it starvation, transportation or being reared in a tiny pen for meat, WHERE does the line actually get drawn???
I
india
Guest
OMG, That's made me feel physically sick!!!
Sorry, but how can anyone condone this by calling it a sport or entertainment?
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vimto92
Guest
Nobody actually said they agree with one and not the other, at least I can't recall it. Why bring it into the topic of conversation when we are still discussing hunting?
And back to the original poster, if EVER the hunt came onto my land or my yards land without having permission I would play bloody holy hell up over it! I disagree with hunting but that is besides the point, this is blantantly trespassing and they shouldn't be allowed to get of with it just because their a hunt.
Whatever it is, it is not an effective method of pest control. Hunting may be useful to get rid of individual 'rogue' foxes, but overall it has the effect of maintaining the status quo. Indeed, it is intended to do so.I’ve think it must be one of the most enlightening and polite discussions on foxhunting that I’ve ever come across. So hat’s off to most of you that’s contributed to it.
Ok, the information I’ve gathered so far from this thread is:
* Foxhunting is more of a social pastime than an effective means of pest control.
Yes, though not as many as predicted - thank goodness!
It is also possible that a fox may suffer an agonising death after being shot, if it is not killed outright. Maybe a certain standard of competence in the use of shotguns and rifles should be required before people are allowed to shoot foxes. That's something else we could debate.
Quoting from "After the Hunt: The future of foxes in Britain" published by IFAW:
"Despite claims that hunted foxes were either killed or escape, with no wounding, there are many accounts from the hunting literature [my emphasis] of instances where foxes that escaped the hounds and went to ground subsequently perished. This was believed to be the result of the trauma of being chased."
That is their instinct yes - though it may lead to them killing more than they could possibly cache. This isn't done for "fun" or out of "badness" - it's just their instinct. If it weren't for the way we keep livestock, a fox wouldn't find so many prey packed together and unable to escape. By keeping a large number of birds together, we are presenting the fox with an unnatural situation - so we should not be too surprised when it responds in a way that seems excessive to us.
I suspect that people who label the fox "evil" do so to rid themselves of any residual empathy they may have for the animal.
Another quote:
"The staple diet of a fox is not, as so many people apparently imagine, hens and ducks. Indeed, it is probably true to say that not 5 per cent of the foxes in Christendom ever taste domestic poultry at all. The poultry killers are a handful of confirmed criminals who have combined a taste for hen with a comparative contempt for man. The majority of foxes live largely upon beetles, frogs, rabbits, and wild birds; carrion does not come amiss to them either, while they are the biggest destroyers of rats and mice in the world, far excelling the domestic cat in this useful art."
This was written in 1955, when domestic stock such as hens and ducks were free-range and so would have been more vulnerable to fox predation than under today's more intensive management regimes.
Where did the quote came from? It's from Brock's "Foxhunting: what it is, and how it is conducted" published by the British Field Sports Society.
Might it be possible to simulate real hunting a bit better, to slow down a drag hunt or introduce breaks in the chase to make it more like the real thing?
Given that hunt followers care for their mounts and the hounds, and so are presumably quite capable of empathising with animals, there must be a certain amount of deliberate or unconscious "blocking out" going on with regard to the fox, which is just another animal after all. They do not allow themselves to empathise with the fox because this would be incompatible with hunting it! (Imagine what it would like to be chased and attacked by hounds? No thanks!)
But it is unfair to single out those who do this for criticism. Many non-hunters keep pets, yet eat meat derived from practices that entail a degree of suffering. Why are we outraged when we learn of some mistreatment of horses or dogs, and yet apparently accept with few qualms the awful things that happen to many pigs and chickens? Aren't we also "blocking out" empathy for them? And where's our empathy when it comes to poisoned rodents who presumably also suffer an agonizing death? (I wouldn't claim to speak for everyone, of course.)
A pretty good summary, I'd say.
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vimto92
Guest
OMG, That's made me feel physically sick!!!
Sorry, but how can anyone condone this by calling it a sport or entertainment?
I agree.
If it was a little child, people would be horrified and would label it "different" to hunting other species - just proves how selfish the human race are really.
J
jaydevon
Guest
beacasue there ar emany types of hunting, fishing is hunting for example, somebody mentioned elephants, again this is hunting, my point is why.how ban one with out the other so infact my comment WAS very relevent to the last 27 pages.
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vimto92
Guest
I understand completely what you are saying but the reason we are on about banning fox hunting is because this is a horse forum. Nobody has said they don't want to ban other types of hunting. At the end of the day, we are discussing fox hunting because it is horse related and one of the most established form of hunting in the Equestrian world.
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jaydevon
Guest
many people are condoning fox hunting, but my point is how ban one with out the other? many are us are saying it is such a big part of the country side, well so are the other forms of hunting, it is a general question related to all regarding hunting in general,
I could add to the argument Yann but I would be repeating pretty much what everyone has already said!!!
I just keep reading the same posts over and over again with the same links/questions and points. I keep looking as I am neither for nor against and I am interested in the points of view when they differ but they are all the same.
What exactly is the point in repeating ourselves?? Is it imperative that someone/side wins this debate or is it going to be one of those that eventually the mods close as its repetative???
As far as I was aware hunting threads such as this one werent allowed?? Anyone care to enlighten me??
Nikki xxxx
I just keep reading the same posts over and over again with the same links/questions and points. I keep looking as I am neither for nor against and I am interested in the points of view when they differ but they are all the same.
What exactly is the point in repeating ourselves?? Is it imperative that someone/side wins this debate or is it going to be one of those that eventually the mods close as its repetative???
As far as I was aware hunting threads such as this one werent allowed?? Anyone care to enlighten me??
Nikki xxxx
Y
Yann
Guest
This has happened at the bloodhound meets I've attended, not all packs are relentlessly fast and furious. With a little imagination it would be possible to replicate even the random nature of the route, the quarry could set a line of their own choosing for example, and the lines can be broken with hacking between them.
I think hunting threads weren't allowed because they always turned nasty, this one hasn't.
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