The True Definition of Bolting?

I've been bolted with twice in my life. And both times, especially the second were the scariest experiences of my riding career. On both occasions the horse (different ones) completley lost it and galloped flat out continually until I came off. There was nothing I could do to stop the horse and I admit it, was probably making matters worse as I had lost my stirrups and was trying to stay on. :S Also, both occasions were in a school which meant the horses were turning in a tiny space as fast as you would expect it to go at full gallop on open ground. Truly terrifying.

I have been 'tanked off with' too and not until I experienced true bolting could I sense the difference. The major one being - with bolting the horse is as frightened if not more than you on top.
 
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It certainly is a losing battle! Can I ask you to elaborate on the word cob? Obviously not it's meaning but in the way that the word is misused?[/QUOTE]

theocat said:
Bex7 said:
If she's anything like me, she'll get annoyed at phrases like "cob x". I was brought up to believe that a cob was a type - so you could happily have a TB x, or an ID x, because those are specific breeds, but when you're talking about a type, the horse either is or it isn't. So a horse could be a TB x and ALSO a cob, but it's inappropriate to describe it as a cob x TB. It could, of course, be a cob that was a cross between a TB and something else, but I'd EITHER describe it as a TB x (if I was talking about breed), OR as a cob. I wouldn't run the two together because, for me, they have different uses, and cob is not a breed - I'd probably say something like "he's a cobby TB x".

Maybe it's just me .... I am very willing to be corrected! :p:p
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I can see why you're bothered by 'x cob' theocat, but it doesn't worry me. It's true a cob is a type not a breed, but I don't see why it shouldn't be used to describe one half of a cross. My daughter's mare had a sire who was a Hanoverian, and a mother who was a hunter (also a type0, so she was described on her passport as Hanoverian x hunter.

No, the proper definition of a cob is a compact, weight-carrying, short-legged utility type of horse, between around 14.2 and 15.1. Showing people have introduced classes for what they call 'maxi-cobs' - cob-type horses too big to be proper cobs (I think they go up to about 15.2 or 15.3). But now all heavy, hairy crosses are called 'cobs', even Shires and the like. Traditionally, a cob was hogged and trimmed (and probably docked too, if you go back far enough); but I don't object to the hairy ones even if they're misleadingly called 'traditionals'. It's the size thing that makes nonsense of the idea of a cob.
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Now Rachel, please tell me i didn't use the phrase "bolt" inncorrectly at any stage of your visits... maybe it has been erased from my memory due to a severe pummelling to the back of the head!
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it's ok jojo, you didn't offend my equine dictionary at any point. although are you sure that enigma wasn't bolting wildly with you when you had minor brake-loss in the field? Looked like she was in total blind panic to me ;) !!

I think I am an old codger at heart though, I don't mind the bouncies, I don't mind the enthusiastic, a bit of airs above the ground is fine... but you are not getting me sat on anything that has been described as bolting, absolutely not.

We all get brake loss - Tia is a very nice person who is very soft mouthed and generally polite - but the other day I went into our fast work field thinking I'd have gallop, forgetting that I didn't quite have the right tack on (cavesson noseband, no martingale and just a nathe straight bar snaffle) I said GO! she obliged, when I went to put the brakes on, her head was up and it took me a good 45 seconds to pull up when it's normally an instant reaction - it happens, I wasn't on the ball and I lost control of an enthusiastic horse. Definitely not bolting though.

KC, to me if you can circle, it isn't bolting, as the horse is still reacting to the riders aids, albeit choosing to ignore the direct stopping one. The horse isn't in blind panic and is aware of his surroundings.

If you want to use the word, then go ahead but two things,

a. you give other people the impression that your horse is dangerous (and that you are a fruitloop for riding it!) when it isn't actually the case... the mentality that someone would want to tag their horse with what is often credited as being the most dangerous vice seems bizarre to me

b. if and when you actually sit on horse which is running in blind panic with no awareness of outside world or rider on board, you have no dialogue left to describe it - you say 'it bolted' and your friends reply 'so? didn't nimby used to do that?'

also, and particularly pertinent in todays suing culture..., I think it is important that we are all aware that stating that a horse has a serious vice could be construed as admitting liability if something were to happen (eg if selling a horse and buyer told that horse has no vices, but an accident happens to them, and they subsequently find evidence of dialogue that horse known to bolt... then you were previously aware of vice and in some way responsible..) worst case scenario, but it would make me think twice about it.
 
Yeah but htat's the thing, it seems anyone around my yard etc understands it in the way i do. I don't know whether this is because we all grew up in the same little horsey gang or what. Only once has Nimby properly bolted, nothings guna stop him kind of thing and it's horrible however we just call everything bolting. Although it would seem i call it bolting or properly bolting. Lol :rolleyes:
 
Masybe we should start an old crusties section? Where discussions are based on experience rather than ego & book knowledge.

As I said before I have a horse that bolts though I'm lucky in that there are normally warnings & triggers that I've learned to recognise. Am I a fruuitloop to ride him? Probably! Joking aside this behaviour means I let very very few other people on him & even then only in the school which is his "safe" zone. There are certain things I don't do with him as I feel they're too high risk & I wouldn't sell him even if I wanted to because I feel it would be irresponsible.

The way the word "bolt" is so freely bandied about makes me even more wary if I want to let someone else on him - I say he can bolt & they hear he can get strong so I have to explain in detail & that makes me sound paranoid & stupid but to do otherwise would be dangerous. The few times people have seen his behaviour they're left in no doubt that it's a true bolt & have no wish whatsoever to get on him.

I really hope all these people who say they've been bolted with then give a different definition never have the misfortune to ride a true bolter.
 
Dooley said:
I really don't think RachelEvent raised the subject to "nitpick". She is making a very valid point in my opinion, as the regular misuse of a word like "bolting" belittles the genuine and utter fear felt by people whose horses have really bolted. RachelEvent is not banging on meaninglessly about people using the wrong words generally, only this one word, and for reasons she explains.

People saying they got bolted with and stating that it was "great fun" or "hilarious" or whatever words are used don't mean to upset others but in my experience that sort of comment does upset people who have been deeply frightened by a bolting horse and then feel that their experience is not being taken seriously or that they are being made to feel "silly".

I also believe it is important on a forum used by all age groups that the correct use of terms should be encouraged. It helps to define exactly what is being discussed. RachelEvent may have worded her post in a way that put the emphasis on her annoyance at the misuse of this one word, but that doesn't take away the validity of her post and it doesn't make it meaningless in my opinion.
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a) i never said RE was banging on meaninglessly--i said there had been in general an increase in nitpicking and nastiness on NR recently

b) how would you enforce correct terminology--would you follow that by spelling and grammar? what about dyslexics -- it's unfair to discriminate

c) the cob-bolting thread was a story told in a light hearted way --most people recognised this-----it's not a crime to tell a story in as entertaining a way as possible --- plus it was a newish members post and we should be a bit more welcoming

d) rachel and i have discussed this off board and it's settled amicably

e) we have a dictionary on this board -- if people need definitions they can go there

f) pulling people up in public about anything is not nice, do it privately like you would in real life -- a decent manager or teacher would do this -- it's ill mannered to humiliate people

g) your last paragraph was very well put--i agree :) but there is a vast difference between encouragement and telling people what to do --plus sometimes the written word comes across harsher than is meant

i) i have bugbears too but generally don't act on them on here -i hate text speak, poor spelling aggrivates me-- but i feel we should try to be tolerant of each other

j) i probably shouldn't have got involved--it's the first time in 8 years i've caused controversy -- but one of my faults is the urge to stand up for people, and to be honest i don't feel too worried about that fault


now, let's let it lie -- as vic and bob would say:)
 
carthorse said:
Masybe we should start an old crusties section? Where discussions are based on experience rather than ego & book knowledge.
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Just as i thought it was not going to be an argument (thanks to Rachel again ;)) firstly you have no way of knowing who's got what knowledge.

I completely understand what your all saying, my horse has properly bolted with me but more of the time just bolts (runs away)... Yep i reckon i just started my own language.

But anyway i'd rather you didn't try and imply i have an ego and book knowledge you know nothing about anyone who's commented on this thread...
 
Have to agree with all of those that say that it is rude to correct people no matter how bugbear you are about it.

I get called Nikki and introduce myself as Nikki as my bug bear is people calling me Nicola when my name is Nicole :) (not got anything wrong with the name it just aint mine lol :D)

Do I correct people for it??? No I dont I just change it ever so slightly so I am not in that situation of correcting people:)

Why not just overlook it?? It would be the mature thing to do in the circumstances.

Also if you hear certain phrases all the time you pick them up. Are we born knowing how to speak. No. We hear it going on around us and we mimic it. if you have been used to hearing certain phrases then you automatically say them and 9 times out of 10 if you say them you type them.

I had this argument on another forum about the use of words when using a stick. I say crack, smack etc when that would mean TO ME that he got one behind the leg for manners or as a send on.

So do I have the right to correct you?? No I dont and I dont intend to I have better things to do with my time that try to correct everyones english.:rolleyes:

Nikki xxxx
 
MrKia+Me said:
Have to agree with all of those that say that it is rude to correct people no matter how bugbear you are about it.

I get called Nikki and introduce myself as Nikki as my bug bear is people calling me Nicola when my name is Nicole :) (not got anything wrong with the name it just aint mine lol :D)

Do I correct people for it??? No I dont I just change it ever so slightly so I am not in that situation of correcting people:)

Why not just overlook it?? It would be the mature thing to do in the circumstances.

Also if you hear certain phrases all the time you pick them up. Are we born knowing how to speak. No. We hear it going on around us and we mimic it. if you have been used to hearing certain phrases then you automatically say them and 9 times out of 10 if you say them you type them.

I had this argument on another forum about the use of words when using a stick. I say crack, smack etc when that would mean TO ME that he got one behind the leg for manners or as a send on.

So do I have the right to correct you?? No I dont and I dont intend to I have better things to do with my time that try to correct everyones english.:rolleyes:

Nikki xxxx
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Nicola;);), how true, agree completely with this :):)
 
ali cat said:
poor spelling aggrivates me
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:D Couldn't resist- sorry!!:D

But yes, a true bolt to me is you might as well be siting behind the wheel of a car and the brakes have been cut- there is nothing you can do. And even worse in a horse as they won't turn and do have their own minds even if they have temporarily lost it for the duration of the bolt.

I have been bolted with 3 times.

1) A tree did not get in the way, luckily enough it was bendy enough to whip between my leg and the saddle- destroying the saddle and de-skinning my leg- Coriander, piebald heavy Heinz 57.
2) The whole ride took off due to a spooky horse in the woods, galloped back to the yard, mine appeared to be the only one in full flight which jumped the 5 bar gate and galloped directly into his stable with me wrapped around his neck- Sebastian- Appaloosa.
3) The whole ride took off due to another spooky horse (however same rider as before so maybe spooky rider as I've not had problems with the "spooky" ones). I was currently on t'other side of an XC jump, so Rosie (TB) took off over the jump and back up to the yard, there was a pile of rubble across the track serving as a makeshift bridge to the new school, she attempted to jump this and tripped so I managed to jump off and lean back on the reins. Clearly the almost-fall shocked her and I managed to reduce the bolt to a buggering off with me on the ends of the reins until she eventually ran into the back of the other horses who had all arrived back at the yard riderless and dripping!

Not experiences I am ever wanting to repeat, bloody scaring knowing you are of no consequence whilst on such large, powerful horses.

Buggering off= you laugh at the end.
Bolting= you wee at the end (or possible during).
 
MrKia+Me said:
Have to agree with all of those that say that it is rude to correct people no matter how bugbear you are about it.

I get called Nikki and introduce myself as Nikki as my bug bear is people calling me Nicola when my name is Nicole :) (not got anything wrong with the name it just aint mine lol :D)

Do I correct people for it??? No I dont I just change it ever so slightly so I am not in that situation of correcting people:)

Why not just overlook it?? It would be the mature thing to do in the circumstances.

Also if you hear certain phrases all the time you pick them up. Are we born knowing how to speak. No. We hear it going on around us and we mimic it. if you have been used to hearing certain phrases then you automatically say them and 9 times out of 10 if you say them you type them.

I had this argument on another forum about the use of words when using a stick. I say crack, smack etc when that would mean TO ME that he got one behind the leg for manners or as a send on.

So do I have the right to correct you?? No I dont and I dont intend to I have better things to do with my time that try to correct everyones english.:rolleyes:

Nikki xxxx
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well said - it annoys me when people confuse/interchange windsucking and cribbing but it has never occured to me publicly point out they technically mean the wrong thing - the purpose of language is to get your point across, if you use the wrong terminology then what does that matter. If you hear the story, the person says bolt but by the description you know they mean tanking off then fine, you understand the story, point moved from one person to another, mission complete.
 
Maybe we should start an old crusties section? Where discussions are based on experience rather than ego & book knowledge.
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ah, but I really am only crusty in nature and not in actual age - I am happy I have never experienced lots of things.


agreed, it isn't polite to pick people up on use of words - its also not polite to tell people what isn't polite, ad infinitum - no winners here!

however as stated several times on thread by different users, there are issues of

a. safety
b. others finding offensive
and c. possibility of litigation

so unike someone saying your name wrong, which has no real issue other than personal taste attached to it, there is a little more reasoning to using the 'correct' words when it comes quite a lot of horsey things
 
I think that the term bolting is used when the rider cannot stop the horse for whatever reason. This may be because they are not a good enough rider, or because the horse is in a blind panic.

I was once bolted with on a riding holiday as a 14 year old. The horse I was riding started to play up and my instructor told me to switch horses with her. I put one foot in the stirrup to mount her horse and he took off with me at full gallop. Now he wasn't running away from pain (I don't think - although perhaps the way I mounted may have hurt his back?), I think that he just wanted to get home. I had no control whatsoever and fell off just before the main road. Some may say that he 'tanked off' with me, but I would maintain that he bolted. I think that the term 'tanked off' refers to a situtation where you are already cantering and the horse gets very strong. The experience made me a nervous wreak hacking for the next 16 years, although I have finally got over that and now LOVE going fast!
 
In theory...

You ask people to define bolting and you get this image of a horse going flat out and the rider stood up in the stirrups, hanging onto the reins for dear life and shouting

"WOOOOOOOAAAAHHHHHHHH!!!!!
WOOOOOOOOAAAAAAAAHHHH!!!!":mad::eek::mad::eek:

What's happened here is the 'bolting' has escalated to flat out full speed.

Surely though the bolting began when the rider mounted and the horse walked off without waiting for the riders aids.

And when the rider asks the horse to go from walk to halt and it takes 10 metres to get the transition.

This is my definition of bolting. Whether it is in walk or gallop, it's when the horse is off the rider's line.
:D
 
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