The stupid hunt ....

[Jojo_82]

A pity, because I genuinely would like to know what motivates those who hunt foxes.

Ok, to keep Yann happy and contribute my tuppence worth! I hunt foxes purely because i know alot of people in the hunting world. I am good friends with a huntsmaster, so go out with him on his days, and for years have seemed to keep bumping into people who are involved with certain hunts and have invited me out, or have lived near meets of foxhunts.

I am not particularly sensitive when it comes to the fox being slaughtered (waits to be shot down in flames!), in the years i have been hunting i have never seen one killed (even when i had to follow the master). I'm not saying it hasn't happened when i've been out, and i'm sure i would be mortified to see it actually happen. However, the enjoyment i get out from going out on a days hunting far outweighs how i feel about the fox being killed. I'm truely very sorry if that upsets anyone. Believe it or not, i love seeing foxes in the wild and often sit in my garden watching them playing, especally the cubs, but i honestly put that aside whilst on the field and normally worry more about being carted with or jumping safely.

Again, very sorry if that offends anyone. In a nutshell, i basically foxhunt because i have always known that circle of people and it's easy for me to arrange a day out with them.

 

[Flash Harry]

Concerning an emotive subject like this there will never be agreement, I agree. However, I don't think it's a black-and-white issue - lots of grey areas in my opinion - and there's still aspects which could be usefully talked about. It doesn't have to be "ever decreasing circles" if people try to move the discussion/debate on in a civilized manner (which is actually what has been happening).

But if you're fed up you don't need to read any more - just don't click on the thread!

Maybe your right.......... forgotten what the O/P was originaly asking advice about......... but hey at this point in the debate i bow out..... with my Gin and Tonic.....hope you find the answers....

 

[Francis Burton]

Jojo_82 - Thank you too for taking time to reply. You haven't offended me in the slightest. On the contrary, I appreciate your candour, and find your answer enlightening.

 

[Camyds]

Ok, to keep Yann happy and contribute my tuppence worth! I hunt foxes purely because i know alot of people in the hunting world. I am good friends with a huntsmaster, so go out with him on his days, and for years have seemed to keep bumping into people who are involved with certain hunts and have invited me out, or have lived near meets of foxhunts.

I am not particularly sensitive when it comes to the fox being slaughtered (waits to be shot down in flames!), in the years i have been hunting i have never seen one killed (even when i had to follow the master). I'm not saying it hasn't happened when i've been out, and i'm sure i would be mortified to see it actually happen. However, the enjoyment i get out from going out on a days hunting far outweighs how i feel about the fox being killed. I'm truely very sorry if that upsets anyone. Believe it or not, i love seeing foxes in the wild and often sit in my garden watching them playing, especally the cubs, but i honestly put that aside whilst on the field and normally worry more about being carted with or jumping safely.

Again, very sorry if that offends anyone. In a nutshell, i basically foxhunt because i have always known that circle of people and it's easy for me to arrange a day out with them.

Cant believe i just read this posthave a good nites sleep I live in the country and have my own views on the slaying of foxes, but my gawd, what double standards you havethat is SO scary its a bit like saying you love watching your neighbours dog with her new puppies, but, once mummy gets out of the garden and you are on horseback with your "pals" then mommy is going to get ripped to shredsbut, that dosent matter cos you know it happens but havent actually "seen" it............ what a **** o ****

 

[Jojo_82]

And now my point has just been proven as to why this thread should be closed... for goodness sake!

 

[Francis Burton]

Camyds - You obviously feel very strongly about the subject, but I'm sad that Jojo_82's honesty and openness should be 'rewarded' with such vitriol. If we can't maintain a modicum of politeness, despite our differing views, this thread will get shut down.

 

[jaydevon]

Cant believe i just read this posthave a good nites sleep I live in the country and have my own views on the slaying of foxes, but my gawd, what double standards you havethat is SO scary its a bit like saying you love watching your neighbours dog with her new puppies, but, once mummy gets out of the garden and you are on horseback with your "pals" then mommy is going to get ripped to shredsbut, that dosent matter cos you know it happens but havent actually "seen" it............ what a **** o ****

i think you have to re read what jj said, she doesnt want to see a fox ripped to bits, she gos for the social side, its so rare to see a fox. dont be offended by her post, better that its a good day out than going to actually see a fox killed, for anyone thats fox or stag hunted, it really isnt about killing.
im sorry but she doesnt have double standards, just a good insite to reality.

 

[Camyds]

Camyds - You obviously feel very strongly about the subject, but I'm sad that Jojo_82's honesty and openness should be 'rewarded' with such vitriol. If we can't maintain a modicum of politeness, despite our differing views, this thread will get shut down.

Correct Francis, when I first saw this topic I knew, as I am sure you and others knew, it would end in a "no win" debate. TBH, I havent been online all weekend (out enjoying ny cuddie) and was really surprised that it was still open. So yeah, it has ran its course now and I vote that it be closed.

 

[Jojo_82]

i think you have to re read what jj said, she doesnt want to see a fox ripped to bits, she gos for the social side, its so rare to see a fox. dont be offended by her post, better that its a good day out than going to actually see a fox killed, for anyone thats fox or stag hunted, it really isnt about killing.
im sorry but she doesnt have double standards, just a good insite to reality.

Thankyou. I've re-read my post about 100 times now in a panic after the response! 'Spose that's the price you pay for being honest sometimes?

If someone asked me to do a day out on a drag hunt and it was as easy/convient to get to as my hunt is now and i had as good a day, i would be well up for it and honestly would like the thought that it wouldn't result in any fox-deaths. As JD says, i mainly go for the social side and trust the routes and jumps the hunt does for my horses safety (I.e. i know most of the jumps/way of going on different days so can be confident i can have a good, safe day with my ned.... which in actually fact, is the main thing for me!).

 

[ameliet1971]

This will probably be my last post on here because I will not have access to a computer for the next ten days.

I would just like to mention that I have certainly enjoyed this discussion. Like most of the other genuine posters, I haven’t contributed to this thread with any intentions of attempting to convert anyone’s views or opinions on hunting with dogs.

What I have attempted to do is produce without prejudice or malice only informative and factual evidence on various aspects of foxhunting.

Hopefully I achieved this without offending too many people.

 

[hedgehunter78]

Also, I don't think any of the pro hunters have just implied that the hunt is purely about the control of fox numbers, it's also about the fun of the hunt surely?

And homes and jobs.

 

[hedgehunter78]

A pity, because I genuinely would like to know what motivates those who hunt foxes.

As i keep saying,part of what motivated me was the love of hounds,a house and job for myself and hubby.

 

[Mary Poppins]

I am not particularly sensitive when it comes to the fox being slaughtered (waits to be shot down in flames!), in the years i have been hunting i have never seen one killed (even when i had to follow the master). I'm not saying it hasn't happened when i've been out, and i'm sure i would be mortified to see it actually happen. However, the enjoyment i get out from going out on a days hunting far outweighs how i feel about the fox being killed. I'm truely very sorry if that upsets anyone. Believe it or not, i love seeing foxes in the wild and often sit in my garden watching them playing, especally the cubs, but i honestly put that aside whilst on the field and normally worry more about being carted with or jumping safely.

I think that is a refreshingly honest response, but I do understand why it will upset people. Personally it would ruin my day if I knew that a fox (or any other animal) had been hurt in order to satisfy my enjoyment. Surely the social side can be obtained from a drag hunt? I just don't understand how you could turn a blind eye to the suffering of an animal.

 

[kirby]

I have done some homework this weekend on Fox Hunting by reading through an old traditional horse care book,

And it tells me how fox hunting came about, to sum it up

The fox pelt was very rare and popular

So foxes were brought live in cages into Britain from Scotland and sold on markets,

Once bought they were sometimes covered in a scent, sorry can't remember which one to make them smell stronger for the hounds

And then on the day of the hunt they were let loose across the land, and as the fox was in an unknown territory ran in straight lines and was caught by the hounds. This became very popular for social circles to join Earls and subsciptions started.

More foxes were imported this way and then killed this way.

Its was eventually banned importing and scenting them.

My book says it began as their fur was so popular.

Cant people who enjoy a days hunting go on a pleasure ride instead?

 

[chev]

So yeah, it has ran its course now and I vote that it be closed.

I see no reason to close it. It has so far been an interesting and generally polite debate. As long as it stays that way, I see no reason not to let it run.

 

[Yann]

Well, having now experienced the non bloodsport version for myself yesterday I can safely say I love it The sense of occasion, the dressing up, the traditions, the togetherness, the full bore riding and the opportunity to cross country that would normally be off limits make a fabulous mix. I would love to go again and can see why people get so addicted to it.

So yeah, it has ran its course now and I vote that it be closed

 

[hedgehunter78]

I have done some homework this weekend on Fox Hunting by reading through an old traditional horse care book,

And it tells me how fox hunting came about, to sum it up

The fox pelt was very rare and popular

So foxes were brought live in cages into Britain from Scotland and sold on markets,

Once bought they were sometimes covered in a scent, sorry can't remember which one to make them smell stronger for the hounds

And then on the day of the hunt they were let loose across the land, and as the fox was in an unknown territory ran in straight lines and was caught by the hounds. This became very popular for social circles to join Earls and subsciptions started.

More foxes were imported this way and then killed this way.

Its was eventually banned importing and scenting them.

My book says it began as their fur was so popular.

Cant people who enjoy a days hunting go on a pleasure ride instead?[/QUOTE]



Erm,no like ive said befor i used to enjoy watching hounds working aaand pleasure rides dont provide homes,jobs and services to farmers.

 

[Mary Poppins]

Erm,no like ive said befor i used to enjoy watching hounds working aaand pleasure rides dont provide homes,jobs and services to farmers.

I would argue that pleasure rides/drag hunts etc. do provide jobs and services to farmers. They take a huge amount of organisation and the land still has to be prepared to the same level as a fox hunt. There is no shortage of people wishing to drag hunt and I believe that the fees are similar to that of a foxhunt. The problem is that some people who work in the fox hunting world are simply not prepared to change their practices. A living can be made out of alternative methods if the will was there - I do not see this as an excuse to continue to kill animals in such a brutal way.

 

[Yann]

A living can be made out of alternative methods if the will was there - I do not see this as an excuse to continue to kill animals in such a brutal way.

Amen to that.

 

[Morganna]

I would argue that pleasure rides/drag hunts etc. do provide jobs and services to farmers. They take a huge amount of organisation and the land still has to be prepared to the same level as a fox hunt. There is no shortage of people wishing to drag hunt and I believe that the fees are similar to that of a foxhunt. The problem is that some people who work in the fox hunting world are simply not prepared to change their practices. A living can be made out of alternative methods if the will was there - I do not see this as an excuse to continue to kill animals in such a brutal way.

I have to agree with this. The Burns enquiry, the official government investigation into hunting with dogs, found that as few as 400 jobs would be lost if fox hunting was banned in the UK and fully replaced with drag hunting. Pro hunters had originally claimed it would be 16,000 jobs on the line which proved to a bit of an exaggeration on their part.

Considering that more people can lose their jobs from the closing of one factory in this country, I don't really think that the "lose jobs, lose home and livelihood" argument really stands up in this. If it was a case of losing jobs, well, you just have to do what everyone else does in times of redundancy and get another job. And neither do I buy the argument of "it's all we know, it's all we have ever done, how are we supposed to get another job". My grandfather worked for the same company for 40 years since he left school and was made redundant - he managed to get another job.

I would never hunt with dogs as the action of killing an animal for sport does not sit comfortably with me, I have no friends who hunt either as they all feel the same. I will however, he attending a drag hunt next year for the first time. None of my horse riding friends would consider fox hunting as an acceptable form of enjoying their equestrian activities but most of them would go drag hunting given the chance. Does that not signify that more people would be injecting funds into drag hunting therefore possibly increasing job availability in this area? Just a thought.